WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:10.320 Music. 00:00:10.238 --> 00:00:13.218 Welcome to the edition podcast and listeners, I have an apology, 00:00:13.578 --> 00:00:17.418 which is that I haven't had Sean McNulty on for far too long, 00:00:17.438 --> 00:00:19.618 but it's okay, everyone. He's back. 00:00:20.038 --> 00:00:23.778 Hello, Sean McNulty, writer of the Anchors, the Wake Up newsletter. How are you? 00:00:24.578 --> 00:00:29.658 Well, it's lovely to be back here across the pond. Yes, I've missed chatting. 00:00:29.918 --> 00:00:33.378 What's nice is we don't have to talk about strikes today because as you were 00:00:33.378 --> 00:00:37.858 explaining to me off air, we're kind of in prime no strike period. 00:00:38.638 --> 00:00:41.378 It's an odd uh calm no one no one is 00:00:41.378 --> 00:00:44.618 talking about it at this point which is nice it's you know a three-year deal 00:00:44.618 --> 00:00:47.678 so uh and they go 2026 will be 00:00:47.678 --> 00:00:50.358 another topic in hollywood as the year goes on but let's not think about that 00:00:50.358 --> 00:00:54.138 right now we have other things going on sean was also trying to explain march 00:00:54.138 --> 00:00:59.278 madness to me um so that was nice they like got a bit awkward when he whipped 00:00:59.278 --> 00:01:04.218 out a whiteboard and a marker pen and like started brackets yeah yeah it all 00:01:04.218 --> 00:01:08.318 got a bit much But it's OK because we have plenty of other things to talk about, 00:01:08.558 --> 00:01:11.398 including actually the place you write for, 00:01:11.998 --> 00:01:14.298 the Anchor, because there's some exciting things happening. 00:01:14.698 --> 00:01:20.778 There's a great story in a media operator today, interview with your boss of bosses, Janice Min. 00:01:21.598 --> 00:01:27.138 The CEO of the Anchor, yes. Yes, the CEO of the Ankler, who's talked about all 00:01:27.138 --> 00:01:31.978 sorts of big numbers and really exciting growth for the Ankler and also talking 00:01:31.978 --> 00:01:33.618 about international expansion, 00:01:33.618 --> 00:01:37.798 which I guess is exciting for you because obviously you guys are rooted in Hollywood, 00:01:37.798 --> 00:01:41.878 but the film industry goes so far beyond that. 00:01:42.943 --> 00:01:46.383 Yeah, we've had Manoya Ravindran, who's based over there in London. 00:01:46.623 --> 00:01:50.743 She contributes to the series Business Column, which is TV-centric, obviously. 00:01:52.283 --> 00:01:55.443 Her pieces are great. I love reading her dispatches there, 00:01:55.523 --> 00:01:59.643 and there's so much change going on that is different than the change in America, 00:01:59.663 --> 00:02:04.363 which I think is very, very important, and it does affect what happens in America, 00:02:04.383 --> 00:02:08.283 and it's good to dial those in. So yeah, I'm excited to see what that product's going to be myself. 00:02:08.783 --> 00:02:13.883 Yeah, and obviously here in the UK as well, we have some specialisms that aren't in the US. 00:02:14.003 --> 00:02:17.483 For instance, we're very, very good at the UK about special effects and things. 00:02:17.603 --> 00:02:23.523 And a lot of the big US studios come to the UK for that side of the business. 00:02:23.663 --> 00:02:26.883 So there are big international links that you guys can really dive into. 00:02:27.883 --> 00:02:31.323 100%. I mean, we speak about all the time with the Angular, the tax incentives 00:02:31.323 --> 00:02:33.723 in the UK, everything, and nothing shoots here anymore. 00:02:33.943 --> 00:02:37.643 It all shoots over there. So that's a big part to dive into. 00:02:37.643 --> 00:02:40.903 The changing dynamics behind that and what's the future of it. 00:02:40.983 --> 00:02:42.123 And obviously, that's not just the UK. 00:02:42.323 --> 00:02:46.683 There's people coming in from other parts of the globe to shoot there as well, as more of a hub. 00:02:46.863 --> 00:02:52.763 So it's an increasingly important part of the business to examine on a more recurring basis. 00:02:53.163 --> 00:02:56.823 Well, we look forward to reading more about that. And I guess from you as a 00:02:56.823 --> 00:03:00.483 personal perspective, I'm trying not to get you into trouble much as I would like to. 00:03:01.483 --> 00:03:04.063 I do it myself every day, sure. Don't worry about it. It's fine. 00:03:04.223 --> 00:03:09.543 Yeah. But it must be exciting to be in this kind of space, because when something 00:03:09.543 --> 00:03:11.483 like the Ankla started, everyone was like, what? 00:03:11.703 --> 00:03:16.343 Who's going to read this newsletter about Hollywood for Hollywood people? 00:03:17.023 --> 00:03:20.783 Why have Y Combinator given you all this money? Like, what's going on here? 00:03:21.123 --> 00:03:27.043 And now you must feel like you're in a really thriving media outlet where we 00:03:27.043 --> 00:03:29.223 know the troubles in lots of mainstream outlets. 00:03:29.223 --> 00:03:36.503 And the Ankla's sort of total focus has allowed really meaningful growth. 00:03:37.857 --> 00:03:41.177 Yeah, I mean, it's a lot of, I'm just going to say, going with your gut. 00:03:41.377 --> 00:03:45.337 It's, you know, we're not writing for anything, or I'll speak for myself. 00:03:45.377 --> 00:03:48.957 I'm not writing for anybody else other than my audience and what I think people 00:03:48.957 --> 00:03:51.497 are interested in and need to know in my analysis. 00:03:51.677 --> 00:03:56.497 And it's my perspective. It's a column. It's not, you know, that journalism 00:03:56.497 --> 00:03:58.737 tradition, per se, it's not just so much reporting stories. 00:03:58.737 --> 00:04:01.537 It is my perspective on things, and it's the way that I deliberate. 00:04:01.537 --> 00:04:04.377 Oh it's a definite Sean McNulty voice yeah 00:04:04.377 --> 00:04:07.257 and that seems to be resonating you know my okay great why 00:04:07.257 --> 00:04:09.877 it is I have you know it's the gift it's the 00:04:09.877 --> 00:04:12.477 gift honestly that's that's yeah the thing I get the 00:04:12.477 --> 00:04:15.437 most and I'm that's what gets you there that's fine by me too but 00:04:15.437 --> 00:04:18.237 uh but it is having it's just speaking to you 00:04:18.237 --> 00:04:21.297 and trying to explain things and and as you 00:04:21.297 --> 00:04:24.357 would on a podcast or as I would if we were you know having 00:04:24.357 --> 00:04:27.397 a drink somewhere whatever it may be at the pub that is 00:04:27.397 --> 00:04:30.217 how you know that these are sometimes very 00:04:30.217 --> 00:04:33.057 complex things but if you break it down a certain way versus 00:04:33.057 --> 00:04:36.317 just here's all the information you figure it out it's walking 00:04:36.317 --> 00:04:38.937 you know people through things and bringing that perspective to it 00:04:38.937 --> 00:04:42.017 which again it's been great to see the response to it it's uh there's 00:04:42.017 --> 00:04:44.737 no promise that this would be something as you said this is a 00:04:44.737 --> 00:04:47.757 very it's a very hollywood very media you know 00:04:47.757 --> 00:04:52.497 film tv streaming centric you know universe here but that specificity also i 00:04:52.497 --> 00:04:56.057 think is what people respond to is that you know what you're getting and that 00:04:56.057 --> 00:04:59.737 you know so it's almost that kind of commonality through specificity theory 00:04:59.737 --> 00:05:06.817 of thing where it's like it has that appeal because it does have that direct focus on the topic. 00:05:07.257 --> 00:05:12.697 Yeah, well, it's very exciting. Those AMO numbers, in AMO it says that subscribers 00:05:12.697 --> 00:05:16.537 are up to 145,000 and a year ago it was 75,000. 00:05:16.697 --> 00:05:20.437 So that's approaching doubling your subscriber numbers in a year, 00:05:20.577 --> 00:05:26.537 which I suspect almost everyone would kill to have that kind of growth. 00:05:26.977 --> 00:05:30.577 It sounds great to me. Yeah, no, listen, I'll take it. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 00:05:31.157 --> 00:05:33.977 Well, I love reading it. Lots of people clearly do. 00:05:34.137 --> 00:05:37.717 So keep up with those gifts, Sean. And I look forward to the kind of international 00:05:37.717 --> 00:05:40.637 and obviously the live events, which Janice talked about as well. 00:05:40.717 --> 00:05:44.817 And we know are so important in this modern kind of media environment. 00:05:45.957 --> 00:05:52.077 Talking of live events, we've got all sorts of Hollywood event awards action. 00:05:52.937 --> 00:05:57.117 Um well there's been the sag awards there's been the oscars of course amongst 00:05:57.117 --> 00:06:02.577 other things we had the baftas over here so there's been all sorts of awards 00:06:02.577 --> 00:06:05.937 fun all broadcast on different tv channels, 00:06:06.737 --> 00:06:09.917 what did you make of award season as a whole let's start there. 00:06:12.677 --> 00:06:16.617 Um man just you know you get so much i mean i'm here in new york and i'm not 00:06:16.617 --> 00:06:19.697 in la and it's really new york givork has a bit of it but i'm not living it 00:06:19.697 --> 00:06:22.897 you know day to day certainly but reading so much from my colleagues at the 00:06:22.897 --> 00:06:25.877 Ankler, Katie Rich is very much, you know, entrenched in this, it's a big topic. 00:06:26.597 --> 00:06:28.117 In the end, you know, the numbers... 00:06:28.864 --> 00:06:32.484 Kind of what they've been since COVID, you know, as it's any bigger or smaller. 00:06:32.704 --> 00:06:35.684 I mean, you're talking a fluctuation in three years of, I guess, 00:06:36.044 --> 00:06:39.744 one million viewers you know, across three different Oscar shows. 00:06:41.344 --> 00:06:46.264 So, you know, that's a year with Enora and then you're with Oppenheimer. 00:06:46.544 --> 00:06:48.284 So, you know, you've had... Barber and Marmer. 00:06:49.024 --> 00:06:53.024 Yes, exactly. Like Oppenheimer winning the award, you know, and so you've had a gamut of 00:06:53.464 --> 00:06:57.064 it wasn't like we just had a bunch of $20 million grossing 00:06:57.064 --> 00:07:00.384 movies like you've had a few things and the audience is still what's what's 00:07:00.384 --> 00:07:03.304 i guess charlotte what's america's interest in this not necessarily what 00:07:03.304 --> 00:07:06.164 the the industry's uh interest is in it 00:07:06.164 --> 00:07:09.464 exactly and that's really what i'm getting at yeah which 00:07:09.464 --> 00:07:12.724 to me is that's where my mind goes as well i think you know we agree on that 00:07:12.724 --> 00:07:16.004 in terms of hollywood it's a it's a very important part of the ecosystem there's 00:07:16.004 --> 00:07:19.344 a lot of spending and money that goes in it still matters immensely to talent 00:07:19.344 --> 00:07:23.664 all those things have come back from you know covet if you will or return to 00:07:23.664 --> 00:07:26.384 the business so that if that's you're looking at that perspective, 00:07:27.084 --> 00:07:30.524 seems to be alive and well in the most part who's spending each year varies 00:07:30.524 --> 00:07:34.604 a little bit but from the public's interest you know we had the Grammys as well 00:07:34.604 --> 00:07:38.044 there's also a big show here earlier in February, 00:07:39.044 --> 00:07:43.564 music not film but exactly but sometimes like an award show what is the interest 00:07:43.564 --> 00:07:47.584 in award shows anymore among the public and that was I probably checked the 00:07:47.584 --> 00:07:51.004 number but I think about 17 million somewhere in there I think you know again 00:07:51.004 --> 00:07:53.804 so that's about your audience And this is the year, 00:07:53.924 --> 00:07:56.584 so this is the first year I streamed on Hulu and had, 00:07:56.804 --> 00:08:01.044 you know, the Oscars was only on linear TV here on the ABC network forever. 00:08:01.284 --> 00:08:04.784 Uh, and this year they, they've, the Oscars came to streaming in 2025, 00:08:04.784 --> 00:08:07.684 which had limited success. 00:08:08.564 --> 00:08:12.804 They had a few, uh, some, some glitches there cutting out reportedly. Uh, so still some. 00:08:13.309 --> 00:08:16.409 Legs to you know to grow out there um and 00:08:16.409 --> 00:08:19.009 that added you know a bump to the audience and no one knows you know 00:08:19.009 --> 00:08:22.229 what was that size gonna be what's it gonna do we had the super bowl here obviously 00:08:22.229 --> 00:08:25.149 early in february and it streamed out a service called tubi 00:08:25.149 --> 00:08:27.869 which i think you guys have there is now as well which is 00:08:27.869 --> 00:08:30.729 a free service you know hulu would still have to be a paid 00:08:30.729 --> 00:08:34.009 subscriber to watch and you know uh tubi 00:08:34.009 --> 00:08:37.149 had a over 13 or close to 14 million viewers you 00:08:37.149 --> 00:08:40.129 know uh for the super bowl which obviously is much bigger audience than the oscars 00:08:40.129 --> 00:08:42.809 so these you know this is charlotte it's all part 00:08:42.809 --> 00:08:45.469 of the changing streaming ecosystem here and you know you change the 00:08:45.469 --> 00:08:48.469 times or you don't but these are these aren't just there's like 00:08:48.469 --> 00:08:51.389 oh you added 200 000 more people like these are meaningful 00:08:51.389 --> 00:08:54.809 audiences now that you're living off the table if you're 00:08:54.809 --> 00:08:57.769 keeping your events in a linear or cable only or 00:08:57.769 --> 00:09:01.369 subscription only environment totally so initially 00:09:01.369 --> 00:09:04.669 it looked like the oscars was at 18.1 million they then 00:09:04.669 --> 00:09:07.749 nielsen finally did some maths and found some viewers under the 00:09:07.749 --> 00:09:11.369 back of the sofa or something and it got it to 19.7 00:09:11.369 --> 00:09:18.349 millions that was a one percent discrete uh increase on the year before uh abc 00:09:18.349 --> 00:09:22.909 said the discrepancy came from a significant portion i'm quoting from variety 00:09:22.909 --> 00:09:28.549 here a significant portion of younger viewers tuning in via mobile devices and 00:09:28.549 --> 00:09:31.289 personal computers whoever would have thought sean. 00:09:32.862 --> 00:09:37.462 That young people want to watch the oscars or that uh people watch on streaming to be fair both, 00:09:38.802 --> 00:09:41.702 for the oscars audience that's true yeah but 00:09:41.702 --> 00:09:44.282 that's you know and again these are hulu subscribers so yes this is 00:09:44.282 --> 00:09:47.082 not a you know there's no free component here but uh so if 00:09:47.082 --> 00:09:49.962 that way i you know that's my mind of like so the oscars deal 00:09:49.962 --> 00:09:52.582 you know it's up in a couple years and that's they're already starting to have 00:09:52.582 --> 00:09:55.482 those negotiations uh about you know where they stay with 00:09:55.482 --> 00:09:58.542 abc gonna stay with disney what you know what's the math here 00:09:58.542 --> 00:10:01.402 yeah so this is the first again 00:10:01.402 --> 00:10:04.162 the first year or have any kind of streaming you know component to the 00:10:04.162 --> 00:10:07.102 oscars it's like okay how big is this audience and you know that's 00:10:07.102 --> 00:10:09.982 and again that's 1.6 i guess a million people 00:10:09.982 --> 00:10:12.942 there in the math and that was just mobile and pc. 00:10:12.942 --> 00:10:16.082 That didn't include streaming hulu on your t on tv so 00:10:16.082 --> 00:10:18.802 we don't even know what you know so that's not included which is 00:10:18.802 --> 00:10:21.582 again is a huge you know part of the audience now even for 00:10:21.582 --> 00:10:24.222 the companies like youtube so the you know 00:10:24.222 --> 00:10:26.922 the pies are expanding and growing and how do you and how do you 00:10:26.922 --> 00:10:29.582 grow find people you know what if it was on the tubi what if 00:10:29.582 --> 00:10:32.202 it was on you know a free streamer what would that do to 00:10:32.202 --> 00:10:35.002 the math so you know the oscars the academy is 00:10:35.002 --> 00:10:37.822 looking to reach as many people in theory as possible that's 00:10:37.822 --> 00:10:40.862 you know it's an advertising based you know business here 00:10:40.862 --> 00:10:43.722 so that's really to keep it you know i'm more 00:10:43.722 --> 00:10:46.542 interested in kind of like okay first point of data we'll have 00:10:46.542 --> 00:10:49.482 i think two more show three two or three more shows before 00:10:49.482 --> 00:10:52.502 the the deal's up with disney so how does 00:10:52.502 --> 00:10:55.642 that affect decisions about that well one thing 00:10:55.642 --> 00:10:58.622 the academy will definitely be pleased about is the 00:10:58.622 --> 00:11:01.982 growth in the 18 to 49 age range which 00:11:01.982 --> 00:11:06.042 per this variety article went from 3.92 to 00:11:06.042 --> 00:11:09.922 4.5 so that's 19 up um 00:11:09.922 --> 00:11:12.882 and last year sorry it was 19 point 00:11:12.882 --> 00:11:16.402 last year was 3.82 so the 00:11:16.402 --> 00:11:21.782 streaming number brought it up to 4.54 this year which again will be really 00:11:21.782 --> 00:11:28.902 pleasing to those advertisers you're referencing and in to you know the academy 00:11:28.902 --> 00:11:32.962 in general for getting some younger viewers interested in this which is not 00:11:32.962 --> 00:11:36.102 traditionally as i understand it where they get their viewers from. 00:11:37.111 --> 00:11:40.691 No, I mean, even the Academy itself has made a major push over the past, 00:11:40.871 --> 00:11:45.351 I'll probably say six, seven years, maybe longer than that, to young and up 00:11:45.351 --> 00:11:47.151 the, uh, the, the voting base, you know, 00:11:47.651 --> 00:11:52.651 kind of, uh, Oscar so white and a lot of, uh, you know, old people went around 00:11:52.651 --> 00:11:55.191 and you still out in the voting of what was reflected about why, 00:11:55.311 --> 00:11:57.571 you know, young films, always getting, you know. 00:11:58.191 --> 00:12:02.151 Voted out by these films featuring, you know, but nobody's talking about it or whatever it might be. 00:12:02.151 --> 00:12:04.771 And there's a big debate going on and they're sure you know you kind of 00:12:04.771 --> 00:12:07.431 saw it it was kind of not to put it against each other but like 00:12:07.431 --> 00:12:10.171 conclave versus an aura where you have conclave featuring a 00:12:10.171 --> 00:12:13.011 lot of older actors of film about you know the pope and 00:12:13.011 --> 00:12:17.271 the catholic church yes you had an aura but i got a film about young young on 00:12:17.271 --> 00:12:21.311 the rise stars about you know a sex worker so it's like in that one out where 00:12:21.311 --> 00:12:25.611 in previous years you probably could have seen conclave being the one that that 00:12:25.611 --> 00:12:29.451 took the award there so all to say that yes you're exactly right that is on 00:12:29.451 --> 00:12:30.231 front of mind of the Academy. 00:12:30.471 --> 00:12:34.751 They've been making active moves to invite younger members into the Academy itself. 00:12:35.091 --> 00:12:38.971 And that's starting to manifest in the movies and the choices and the audience. 00:12:39.151 --> 00:12:42.011 They want to, obviously, yes, you don't want to have a, you want to have an 00:12:42.011 --> 00:12:44.731 audience that you want to reach, you know, a wide swath of people. 00:12:44.911 --> 00:12:48.671 So Hulu again, generally has an audience that in the more recent numbers, 00:12:48.731 --> 00:12:53.351 you know, a good, let's say 15 to 20 years younger on average than the linear television audience. 00:12:53.351 --> 00:12:57.771 So just on that, you know, basis alone, you're going to reach those kinds of 00:12:57.771 --> 00:13:02.531 people who are just the cord cutters, cord nevers who don't have a cable TV bundle. 00:13:02.811 --> 00:13:05.551 And again, what else can you do? It's like the Tubi numbers reached. 00:13:05.671 --> 00:13:08.071 It's like you're reaching even younger, younger, younger people there, 00:13:08.191 --> 00:13:09.511 people, you know, so different audiences. 00:13:09.771 --> 00:13:11.871 So front of mind and we'll see 00:13:11.871 --> 00:13:15.231 what the, you know, the Academy has a longstanding deal at ABC and Disney. 00:13:15.411 --> 00:13:20.071 So we'll see if they really make a push to redefine that for the next generation. 00:13:20.071 --> 00:13:23.211 If it's a long-term deal, you're committing to a, you know, a business model, 00:13:23.331 --> 00:13:26.031 not just a home there and your thinking. 00:13:26.591 --> 00:13:30.711 Yeah, and the SAG Awards, the Screen Actors Guild Awards, have moved to Netflix. 00:13:30.991 --> 00:13:33.931 It's part of Netflix's move to live. 00:13:34.492 --> 00:13:40.452 That's one element of this. And the other element is it's the awards seasons move to streaming. 00:13:40.652 --> 00:13:43.892 They both correspond, which is very interesting to watch. 00:13:44.412 --> 00:13:47.432 The SAG numbers kind of did okay, I think. 00:13:48.012 --> 00:13:51.192 Yeah. Nothing spectacular, nothing disastrous. 00:13:52.172 --> 00:13:55.252 Yeah, it's never been a huge – I mean, one of the reasons it kind of went to 00:13:55.252 --> 00:13:58.672 Netflix is it never – it was on TNT. It bounced around a little bit. 00:13:58.852 --> 00:14:01.072 Like, it was never doing a great number on linear television. 00:14:01.752 --> 00:14:04.912 Uh netflix found value in it as you said either a just 00:14:04.912 --> 00:14:07.712 to have it and b to have another live event which they're trying 00:14:07.712 --> 00:14:10.652 to again sell advertising and kind of you know get their the 00:14:10.652 --> 00:14:13.612 wheels turning more on that but you know 2.6 million 00:14:13.612 --> 00:14:17.792 views globally that doesn't include the actual premiere night that's kind of 00:14:17.792 --> 00:14:23.092 the one the monday to the sunday after you know after it happens so i think 00:14:23.092 --> 00:14:27.592 last year was 1.9 million so certainly you know a tick up there and that's a 00:14:27.592 --> 00:14:30.672 total view so it assumes everybody watched the whole show, et cetera, et cetera. 00:14:31.212 --> 00:14:35.232 There's an internal Netflix number. So that's a global number. 00:14:35.472 --> 00:14:38.212 There's no US data on that, et cetera, et cetera. 00:14:38.432 --> 00:14:42.672 I think we're in the kind of 1.8 million range for viewership, 00:14:42.792 --> 00:14:43.872 according to the LA Times. 00:14:44.412 --> 00:14:47.692 So that's pretty good for Netflix. 00:14:47.712 --> 00:14:52.532 1.8 million people using the service at the same time. The whole thing doesn't fall over. 00:14:53.552 --> 00:14:56.972 It's a live event. It's a live event. They get more of that. 00:14:56.972 --> 00:15:04.972 Um i you know it's not christmas day nfl game but it's right exactly but yeah it's another tick. 00:15:06.172 --> 00:15:08.952 That's certainly for them sure the price isn't that high either so you know 00:15:08.952 --> 00:15:14.012 if it makes a lot of sense now am i right that ted sarandes is now the chair 00:15:14.012 --> 00:15:16.292 whatever president president of the, 00:15:20.700 --> 00:15:27.260 uh and would surely like to bring the oscars to netflix surely that is the next play. 00:15:27.880 --> 00:15:30.980 Netflix involved in the academy yes you know i think uh 00:15:30.980 --> 00:15:33.620 sure i mean netflix is seems to be 00:15:33.620 --> 00:15:36.520 open for business they are open for nfl 00:15:36.520 --> 00:15:39.260 when those conversations start uh you know 00:15:39.260 --> 00:15:42.540 to let in the latter part of the decade there the 2029 uh 00:15:42.540 --> 00:15:45.100 theoretically think of the thinking is going to happen that that's going to 00:15:45.100 --> 00:15:48.340 happen then so anything this is what's happening charles is any conversation 00:15:48.340 --> 00:15:51.360 you know anything anything that's up netflix is now in negotiations they 00:15:51.360 --> 00:15:54.520 just signed the women's world cup they got you know coming up 00:15:54.520 --> 00:15:57.300 yeah so then the 2027 one uh and 00:15:57.300 --> 00:16:00.520 i think that they're 2031 as well yeah it's taken to 00:16:00.520 --> 00:16:03.560 but it's to the u.s rights only it's not right but 00:16:03.560 --> 00:16:06.320 there but that's what was available and they were they came to play 00:16:06.320 --> 00:16:09.140 so anything that's you know and now ufc is certainly you know 00:16:09.140 --> 00:16:12.140 they're up for negotiation they're in exclusive rights with that's 00:16:12.140 --> 00:16:14.860 an interesting disney right so we'll see that 00:16:14.860 --> 00:16:18.120 they have obviously the part of tko they already have the WWE so 00:16:18.120 --> 00:16:21.600 we'll see about that so you know they're just in these conversations now 00:16:21.600 --> 00:16:24.500 where even you know a year maybe 18 months ago 00:16:24.500 --> 00:16:27.780 was like oh we're looking at it you know where advertising changed 00:16:27.780 --> 00:16:30.540 so much about Netflix that they you have to be this 00:16:30.540 --> 00:16:33.500 is where the ad money is going if you're gonna be a player in 00:16:33.500 --> 00:16:36.520 video advertising you have to be bidding for 00:16:36.520 --> 00:16:39.380 these things and you know at least in the conversation about anything that 00:16:39.380 --> 00:16:42.220 comes up so the Oscars will certainly be 00:16:42.220 --> 00:16:45.800 falling into that category when the negotiations become more yeah 00:16:45.800 --> 00:16:48.700 I mean just before i hit record on this show i had an email from 00:16:48.700 --> 00:16:53.800 netflix telling me they're doing a new john mulani uh live show yeah yeah so. 00:16:53.800 --> 00:16:58.400 You know uh yep yep it's not just sport but obviously sport is very very important 00:16:58.400 --> 00:17:06.080 in the live space uh as i've done written much about before but it's it is. 00:17:07.700 --> 00:17:10.720 Interesting how they're using the space of 00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:16.460 awards ceremony to sort of maybe keep hollywood happy because obviously there 00:17:16.460 --> 00:17:19.940 is this huge tension isn't there i've heard matt bellany for example talk about 00:17:19.940 --> 00:17:24.960 this on various podcasts the tension of netflix wanting to be in hollywood but 00:17:24.960 --> 00:17:26.260 hollywood not liking that it's 00:17:26.260 --> 00:17:30.340 completely broken their model of getting films into theaters and so on, 00:17:30.880 --> 00:17:34.220 and as i say ted so anderson is the chair of 00:17:34.220 --> 00:17:37.080 the board of trustees for the academy board of trustees okay 00:17:37.080 --> 00:17:39.820 i got it yeah academy museum of motion pictures is 00:17:39.820 --> 00:17:42.780 technically where he's a he's the uh chair of but 00:17:42.780 --> 00:17:45.560 you know he so he's obviously very intimately involved with 00:17:45.560 --> 00:17:48.480 the academy is a by definition a 00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:51.180 big player in the movie space because you know he's tense 00:17:51.180 --> 00:17:58.000 around us at netflix and so it's this interesting dynamic at play i think and 00:17:58.000 --> 00:18:02.920 i wonder the cost of the sag award rights is pocket change to netflix right 00:18:02.920 --> 00:18:06.000 i have to i don't know what the number is but i can't imagine it's very large 00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:10.660 especially to netflix you're 100 right yes and the fact you neither of us know the number of hands, 00:18:11.080 --> 00:18:14.840 shows it was not significant for us to be aware of it. Exactly, exactly. 00:18:15.200 --> 00:18:18.600 So that's quite a nice way of playing nice with Hollywood, isn't it? 00:18:19.450 --> 00:18:22.750 It buys you a lot of cred, yeah, when you're supporting, and again, 00:18:23.190 --> 00:18:27.010 SAG is a union. They were on strike last year. I remember. 00:18:27.750 --> 00:18:32.490 Ted was one of the lead of the four members that were leading those negotiations. 00:18:32.730 --> 00:18:34.450 He was, you know, and then there's a lot of contention. 00:18:34.730 --> 00:18:37.430 I didn't like him that much. That was exactly, it's amazing what a year's difference 00:18:37.430 --> 00:18:39.810 can be, where everybody can come back around to it. 00:18:40.330 --> 00:18:44.330 So you're right, there is some, call it goodwill, call it whatever you want 00:18:44.330 --> 00:18:49.190 to have around that idea, and being this home for where talent comes. 00:18:49.470 --> 00:18:53.450 And this is where people are featured. So it's more to the public in that sense. 00:18:53.690 --> 00:18:57.850 So yeah, I mean, the Oscars, I mean, the thing about the Oscars though, 00:18:57.950 --> 00:19:02.630 that's very unique where the SAG Awards covers TV and film and a lot of the 00:19:02.630 --> 00:19:06.230 Oscars is just theatrical movies, something Netflix does not do. 00:19:07.330 --> 00:19:11.070 So that is the real question mark there. 00:19:11.210 --> 00:19:16.010 And the Academy has their, films have to go into theaters to be considered good for an Oscar. 00:19:16.010 --> 00:19:21.190 There was a whole debate about that yeah apple had to put coda into theaters 00:19:21.190 --> 00:19:26.990 yeah so that it could be nominated and win best picture um netflix has been 00:19:26.990 --> 00:19:31.550 desperate to win best picture for years apple beat it to it part of the problem 00:19:31.550 --> 00:19:34.130 for netflix is the way it does theatrical releases, 00:19:35.070 --> 00:19:39.270 yeah i mean it's the perception among those voters and maybe there is that again that. 00:19:40.210 --> 00:19:42.910 Resentment or call whatever you want whatever word you want to put or 00:19:42.910 --> 00:19:45.930 hesitation perhaps or you know that matters can show 00:19:45.930 --> 00:19:49.570 up rules right they're very strict criteria your film 00:19:49.570 --> 00:19:52.430 has to have been in cinemas for x amount of time in 00:19:52.430 --> 00:19:56.110 x amount of places to qualify for consideration and 00:19:56.110 --> 00:20:00.050 they tied it up after covid didn't they yes exactly 00:20:00.050 --> 00:20:03.290 right because covid they had to bend obviously shut 00:20:03.290 --> 00:20:05.910 down and you know and they kind of were like well what are we going to 00:20:05.910 --> 00:20:08.910 do you know we've already done it this way and we've had one or two shows 00:20:08.910 --> 00:20:11.750 that went by these rules and they came back and said 00:20:11.750 --> 00:20:14.470 you know no you need to now be in i want to say it's 00:20:14.470 --> 00:20:17.170 in six cities and you have you know like again you have you can't just put 00:20:17.170 --> 00:20:20.430 it even in new york and la which was the old kind of trick of 00:20:20.430 --> 00:20:23.150 it it was like you have to now you know so they've you 00:20:23.150 --> 00:20:27.130 know maintained that and kept that as a thing so again i mean the thing about 00:20:27.130 --> 00:20:32.510 netflix is you know they are a producer of movie a big major supplier of films 00:20:32.510 --> 00:20:36.570 but from a distribution point of view in america if you're looking to reach 00:20:36.570 --> 00:20:40.830 the most people netflix you know you're talking uh the number is probably somewhere around 80 million, 00:20:41.010 --> 00:20:44.730 you know, people have Netflix outside of including bonus member, 00:20:44.810 --> 00:20:48.390 you know, add additional members to account. So it's probably even larger than that. 00:20:48.950 --> 00:20:53.790 American cable TV is barely at 65 million at this point, a linear TV. 00:20:53.990 --> 00:20:56.170 So if you're trying to, you know, so, and put that out to 20, 00:20:56.310 --> 00:20:58.670 28, right? So that's just right now. 00:20:58.990 --> 00:21:03.290 End of 2024 was the last time those numbers came in. So they're just the de 00:21:03.290 --> 00:21:08.450 facto distribution system, you know, which is up here. if you have a show of 00:21:08.450 --> 00:21:11.150 the Academy or whoever you are, rights holder. 00:21:11.996 --> 00:21:14.936 Well, I want to go reach the most people. Well, that is Netflix hand down. 00:21:15.136 --> 00:21:17.556 Maybe Amazon gives you that scale. They don't really, you know, 00:21:17.636 --> 00:21:22.056 again, they do very well in American football and NFL here and so forth. They have the NBA deal. 00:21:22.796 --> 00:21:27.256 So it's no longer this linear television. Well, they're getting rid of Premier 00:21:27.256 --> 00:21:30.716 League football here. They're giving up on that and just trying to get more Champions League. 00:21:32.236 --> 00:21:38.976 But they did do okay with live stuff here. It's not quite the same extent as we've seen in the U.S. 00:21:39.696 --> 00:21:42.116 Yeah, it's felt like it's kind of hedge pits and struts they're a little bit 00:21:42.116 --> 00:21:45.696 more trying to nail that down for sure and netflix feels like more of a. 00:21:46.376 --> 00:21:52.256 You know an appropriate home for award shows i think than amazon prime video, 00:21:52.876 --> 00:21:56.176 i think amazon would probably like to have a word with you about that but i'm 00:21:56.176 --> 00:22:00.296 sure they would but i don't know it would change my opinion uh no of course 00:22:00.296 --> 00:22:04.676 the academy of country music awards which is only again here's a stream it's 00:22:04.676 --> 00:22:08.136 not a large event they have not to your point charlotte they They haven't, 00:22:08.436 --> 00:22:12.956 outside of sports, I really can't think of a live thing they've, 00:22:13.476 --> 00:22:16.076 I mean, outside of the country music thing that they do. 00:22:16.696 --> 00:22:20.276 Again, Netflix, you're right, is doing the SAG Awards. They're doing hot dog 00:22:20.276 --> 00:22:23.436 eating contests. They're doing boxing, you know, boxing events. 00:22:23.636 --> 00:22:27.356 They're doing live roasts. You know, Amazon isn't doing any of those things. 00:22:27.356 --> 00:22:28.936 They're just doing live sports. 00:22:29.136 --> 00:22:33.156 They have, you know, for here, they have, again, NFL Weekly. They have NBA coming. 00:22:33.316 --> 00:22:36.316 They have the National Women's Soccer League. just launched or is launching 00:22:36.316 --> 00:22:38.396 this week on Friday nights every week. 00:22:38.636 --> 00:22:41.596 Uh, the New York Yankees have 20 games streaming on Amazon this summer. 00:22:42.156 --> 00:22:48.316 Uh, so, you know, they're very sports centric, but from a pop culture point 00:22:48.316 --> 00:22:49.456 of view, they're, they're not, you're right. 00:22:49.536 --> 00:22:52.896 They're not playing in that field and perceived if you are an award show, 00:22:52.896 --> 00:22:55.976 maybe not as your, your destination. So it's a, yeah, it's a valid point. 00:22:56.176 --> 00:23:00.376 So do you, do you think as you know, in a year's time when those negotiations, 00:23:00.376 --> 00:23:04.816 you know maybe continue with ABC and Disney more broadly do you think we're 00:23:04.816 --> 00:23:11.056 going to see the Oscars move to uh say Netflix Netflix seems to be the only 00:23:11.056 --> 00:23:12.196 one that would take it away. 00:23:13.743 --> 00:23:16.183 I think Amazon, I think, again, we'll be in the conversation. 00:23:16.363 --> 00:23:19.043 Certainly, you know, I don't think that just to go through players. 00:23:19.223 --> 00:23:23.863 I don't think CBS will be in the mix or Paramount. I don't necessarily see NBCU 00:23:23.863 --> 00:23:25.043 or Peacock looking at it. 00:23:25.243 --> 00:23:28.843 And again, also Charlotte, the interesting thing to point out here is I'm almost 00:23:28.843 --> 00:23:32.163 certain of this, but the global rights kind of like come up. 00:23:33.183 --> 00:23:35.983 So right now, I guess you pointed out, this is U.S. only. 00:23:36.263 --> 00:23:40.903 And, you know, so will the Academy take that global perspective or do they see 00:23:40.903 --> 00:23:43.403 more value in selling off by market by market? 00:23:43.403 --> 00:23:46.083 Per se uh and what that deal entails again it's a 00:23:46.083 --> 00:23:48.983 live event that airs in la you 00:23:48.983 --> 00:23:51.803 know new york time so as much as the on 00:23:51.803 --> 00:23:55.163 you know what's the live you know quotient of this yeah 00:23:55.163 --> 00:23:58.423 on a global scale you know they'll watch it on demand certainly that's that's 00:23:58.423 --> 00:24:03.403 valuable but even as we saw at the sag awards or wwe raw is on you know on netflix 00:24:03.403 --> 00:24:07.123 now in the larger amount of the amount of the world yeah you're not seeing it 00:24:07.123 --> 00:24:10.863 but it's one o'clock in the morning yeah well exactly and it's and that it makes 00:24:10.863 --> 00:24:12.663 the top 10 in the UK every week still, 00:24:12.783 --> 00:24:15.743 even with that factor to it. Did you have to be not live though? 00:24:16.023 --> 00:24:18.263 Well, no, exactly right. It's probably not live. Is that delayed? 00:24:18.343 --> 00:24:21.843 So how much, how much delayed activity is there for an award show where once 00:24:21.843 --> 00:24:26.363 you know that who won, okay, I don't know that maybe, you know, it's a valid question. 00:24:26.423 --> 00:24:29.043 I don't know that, you know, what the, what the on-demand viewership would be 00:24:29.043 --> 00:24:31.803 for it. So, but it's, uh, the Academy has a lot of decisions to make. That's for sure. 00:24:32.103 --> 00:24:37.603 Yeah. Cause in the UK this year, it was on ITV and ITVX, which is free, free to air. 00:24:38.283 --> 00:24:43.523 Oh, they had a free streamer. Okay. Yeah. So ITV is one of the public broadcasters. 00:24:43.743 --> 00:24:46.823 Well, it's not public, but it's a free-to-air channel. 00:24:48.943 --> 00:24:52.523 And it's ITVX streaming service you can watch for free as well. 00:24:52.563 --> 00:24:56.203 So it was completely free to watch in the UK. I have no idea of the UK numbers. 00:24:56.323 --> 00:24:59.803 I haven't heard barely anyone saying that they watched it in the UK. 00:24:59.943 --> 00:25:02.763 I will defer to you on that. I saw nothing either out of that. 00:25:03.083 --> 00:25:07.203 People can't maybe pick up who won and like to laugh at Adrian Brody making 00:25:07.203 --> 00:25:08.923 overzealous speeches and whatever. 00:25:08.923 --> 00:25:11.943 But right i think the timing just 00:25:11.943 --> 00:25:14.983 stuff it doesn't make such a big impact unless perhaps 00:25:14.983 --> 00:25:17.903 it's a british film where people might get right if 00:25:17.903 --> 00:25:20.663 there's something along those lines but yeah the time delay does just make a 00:25:20.663 --> 00:25:23.923 big difference in all these live events that are happening i feel that which 00:25:23.923 --> 00:25:28.743 is obviously an interesting thing to stream a light netflix which is so based 00:25:28.743 --> 00:25:35.183 around everyone in the world can watch it wherever you want and you know we can both watch whatever, 00:25:35.703 --> 00:25:40.283 the Lincoln lawyer comes out the same day for both. Do you know what I mean? 00:25:41.123 --> 00:25:44.043 Yeah. Live obviously is a completely different dynamic. This is not where I 00:25:44.043 --> 00:25:48.323 thought the conversation was going to go actually, but it's something I've been pondering. And so, 00:25:49.041 --> 00:25:52.081 live does change all of those dynamics and of 00:25:52.081 --> 00:25:54.901 course what you've really been hinting at throughout this conversation is 00:25:54.901 --> 00:25:57.681 what shifted the dial profoundly whether it's live 00:25:57.681 --> 00:26:00.741 sport or award shows is the acceptance of 00:26:00.741 --> 00:26:05.981 advertising yes and that is where a large proportion of their revenue growth 00:26:05.981 --> 00:26:10.001 is going to be uh they have a lot of runway to go i don't know if you have the 00:26:10.001 --> 00:26:15.981 ad cheer there or not in the uk but here i have it yes i mean i watch it i get 00:26:15.981 --> 00:26:19.721 maybe one ad in a break it's it's not It's minimal at best, 00:26:19.901 --> 00:26:22.981 especially compared to other streamers here in the States, especially. 00:26:23.261 --> 00:26:25.661 Yeah, I mean, I definitely get more on Paramount+, I would say. 00:26:26.141 --> 00:26:29.101 Exactly, yeah, definitely get more on Paramount+, but yeah, definitely versus 00:26:29.101 --> 00:26:30.501 Max or other things that are around here. 00:26:30.621 --> 00:26:34.361 So they're at those extremely light, all to say that there's a lot of runway 00:26:34.361 --> 00:26:35.961 there for them in the future. 00:26:37.341 --> 00:26:39.501 So they're going to be looking more and more. They're becoming, 00:26:39.501 --> 00:26:42.741 you know, television. It's just like this is what the model is. 00:26:42.861 --> 00:26:43.961 It's advertising and, you know. 00:26:44.721 --> 00:26:47.841 Advertising plus subscription. Yeah, plus subscription, which is what cable TV was. 00:26:47.841 --> 00:26:50.901 It's you paid for cable and you also got advertising on it or satellite 00:26:50.901 --> 00:26:54.361 you know in the uk whatever it might be for sky what's old 00:26:54.361 --> 00:26:57.481 is new again and when you have those things you need to 00:26:57.481 --> 00:27:01.501 be getting things that are getting mass audiences and you're you're at the mercy 00:27:01.501 --> 00:27:05.721 of what advertisers tell you they want not what you want to do yeah so that's 00:27:05.721 --> 00:27:09.881 that's where netflix of course got famous for being quite bold with things yeah 00:27:09.881 --> 00:27:12.661 and we're going to support these we want to do these things we support you and 00:27:12.661 --> 00:27:15.741 now you're like hey pal you're not you know you're not the only Of course, 00:27:15.801 --> 00:27:19.441 the fun of advertising means. 00:27:19.921 --> 00:27:20.801 Yes, please. 00:27:21.381 --> 00:27:24.341 It's fun for you and I because it means we get more numbers because they have 00:27:24.341 --> 00:27:26.241 to be much more transparent about the numbers. 00:27:26.621 --> 00:27:31.461 So having Nielsen check up on who watched the Oscars, et cetera, 00:27:31.601 --> 00:27:33.521 et cetera, et cetera. And that'll be interesting to watch. 00:27:33.641 --> 00:27:36.421 I mean, you know, Amazon with NFL is Nielsen rated. 00:27:36.701 --> 00:27:42.621 You know, the WWE Raw is not Nielsen rated on Netflix. So, you know. You surprise me. 00:27:43.280 --> 00:27:46.720 Uh, well, they, exactly. So that's what I mean. 00:27:46.780 --> 00:27:49.400 You'll see what, and we'll see what the NBA next year here in the States, 00:27:49.420 --> 00:27:52.720 at least we'll be in that next step of like, okay, are we getting Nielsen, 00:27:52.900 --> 00:27:53.820 you know, numbers on that? 00:27:53.940 --> 00:27:57.180 How, what are the advertisers making you do or not making you do? 00:27:57.420 --> 00:28:00.220 Cause they're the ones who, you know, ultimately decide this stuff. 00:28:00.360 --> 00:28:04.000 And that's a frontier that in the second half of this decade is going to be 00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:06.480 unrecognizable to what we've grown up with here in the past, 00:28:06.620 --> 00:28:09.200 you know, our whole professional lives. For sure. 00:28:09.440 --> 00:28:14.360 I want to bring it back to kind at the beginning of the conversation where you 00:28:14.360 --> 00:28:17.100 were talking about the impact of the award shows themselves. 00:28:18.800 --> 00:28:23.260 So I have a simple question for you. Okay. Who cares about the award shows? 00:28:23.380 --> 00:28:25.400 Who cares about the Oscars? Oh boy, you're asking me this question? 00:28:25.500 --> 00:28:27.060 That's a dangerous topic. 00:28:27.320 --> 00:28:29.620 That's why I asked you. I'm putting my mic on you. 00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:33.680 I've got a cup of tea ready. Enjoy yourselves. Yeah, yeah. 00:28:33.980 --> 00:28:40.460 You see my mind always goes to the business aspects of this and if I walk into the pub and ask people, 00:28:40.460 --> 00:28:43.480 you know who won best picture and how many people are gonna have any clue what 00:28:43.480 --> 00:28:46.460 i'm even talking about uh but you 00:28:46.460 --> 00:28:49.280 know so there's that aspect of it um people in 00:28:49.280 --> 00:28:52.520 the business care immensely so i would say if you're talking about the 00:28:52.520 --> 00:28:55.340 people who create your tv shows and 00:28:55.340 --> 00:28:58.260 and movies they care very much about 00:28:58.260 --> 00:29:01.240 this uh emmys of course will be coming up in the fall for the 00:29:01.240 --> 00:29:04.720 tv folks um so it's it matters 00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:07.760 as much as it ever has i don't think there's ever been a real 00:29:07.760 --> 00:29:11.480 decrease even you know if the audiences aren't 35 40 00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:14.260 million even 30 million that maybe they were getting you know 00:29:14.260 --> 00:29:16.980 in the 2000s or even 2010s if it's 00:29:16.980 --> 00:29:20.220 only only 20 million you know viewers at this point uh that 00:29:20.220 --> 00:29:25.100 hasn't dampened the enthusiasm in hollywood i can tell you that 100 uh there's 00:29:25.100 --> 00:29:29.060 still a lot if not even more money the campaign for maybe it's my perception 00:29:29.060 --> 00:29:34.300 seems to get longer as time goes on it starts earlier you know the can has gotten 00:29:34.300 --> 00:29:37.260 hot you know the noro that came out of can a lot of. 00:29:38.320 --> 00:29:41.140 That's where yeah and for years for a 00:29:41.140 --> 00:29:44.480 while there can was not it was very much more 00:29:44.480 --> 00:29:47.320 niche in that sense so that's that starts in may so like that 00:29:47.320 --> 00:29:49.920 again these conversations i know sorry i didn't want 00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:52.820 to bring that up but it is it's two months away at this point uh then 00:29:52.820 --> 00:29:56.080 you get the summer off until toronto so summer summer's still the blockbuster summer 00:29:56.080 --> 00:29:58.800 still has that kind of conversation going on uh all to 00:29:58.800 --> 00:30:01.520 say that you know i think it's as healthy as 00:30:01.520 --> 00:30:04.700 ever in terms of you know the award season in the award circuit 00:30:04.700 --> 00:30:08.020 uh in the business there's been no dampening of any 00:30:08.020 --> 00:30:10.720 kind of from again a spending or an 00:30:10.720 --> 00:30:13.480 attention or desire to have you know to 00:30:13.480 --> 00:30:16.700 get that oscar so um that's my 00:30:16.700 --> 00:30:20.080 takeaway from my personally not i have other things i focus on but you know 00:30:20.080 --> 00:30:25.640 but uh but everybody else is very much entwined and is it still the case it 00:30:25.640 --> 00:30:31.200 must be that winning an oscar at the best picture best actor at Oscars drives 00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:33.900 a second wave of viewership to your movie. 00:30:35.259 --> 00:30:39.439 Yeah. I mean, it's to a degree. I mean, we saw it with Anora this weekend here 00:30:39.439 --> 00:30:42.459 in the US, you know, and look, it depends on your movie came out. 00:30:42.619 --> 00:30:44.979 The thing is, I mean, my colleague, Richard Rushfield said, you know, 00:30:45.079 --> 00:30:47.459 he thinks the Oscars should be held in January when it's like, 00:30:47.499 --> 00:30:50.939 you know, in March, you're talking about films that came out six months ago, 00:30:51.199 --> 00:30:54.319 you know, in this day and age of sped up cycles. 00:30:54.499 --> 00:30:57.159 It's like, you need to be more relevant here. But so to your point, 00:30:57.319 --> 00:31:01.899 I don't know that that bump that you would see traditionally would be as manifested. 00:31:02.499 --> 00:31:05.959 And Nora saw $1.9 million, I think, in the box office this weekend, 00:31:06.099 --> 00:31:09.779 which is about $1,000 a screen, which is not nothing, especially for a film that's grossed. 00:31:09.799 --> 00:31:13.659 I think it's close to $19 million now. And didn't cost very much to make. 00:31:14.299 --> 00:31:20.019 It's a $6 million budget, but they spent somewhere around $17 to $18 million to market it. 00:31:20.739 --> 00:31:24.219 So, you know, welcome to the movie business, Charlotte. But, 00:31:24.219 --> 00:31:27.659 uh, I get into the notes that I wrote those Sunday in the wake up, 00:31:27.719 --> 00:31:31.019 the dynamics of all the money there for an aura, but, uh, yeah, 00:31:31.139 --> 00:31:32.219 but, you know, so there's a bump there. 00:31:32.319 --> 00:31:35.939 It's a bump for, you know, Adrian Brody gets a night. He'll have plenty of scripts 00:31:35.939 --> 00:31:37.779 in his, uh, coffer this week. 00:31:37.879 --> 00:31:40.239 You know, I'm sure he has or he has an evil Knievel project. 00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:43.219 He was, you know, already, already rumored to be around with Leo DiCaprio. 00:31:43.739 --> 00:31:47.539 Uh, so that's fine. You know, uh, Mikey Madison, he's just like, 00:31:47.619 --> 00:31:49.659 okay, you are an Oscar winner before you. 00:31:49.739 --> 00:31:53.219 Nobody knew, nobody knew her name a year ago. And now, so for her, 00:31:53.379 --> 00:31:58.419 100%, Sean Baker, who won four Oscars, who directed Inora, you know, 00:31:58.499 --> 00:32:01.399 so now he, you know, but he's like, he's a committed indie guy. 00:32:01.579 --> 00:32:04.179 So like, you know, he's not, he doesn't want to go do a Marvel film. 00:32:04.239 --> 00:32:07.719 He wants to, you know, kind of stay in and fight that spirit. 00:32:07.719 --> 00:32:10.579 So that's heartening to see. So yeah, it still means something along those lines. 00:32:10.719 --> 00:32:13.539 It's not a huge, you know, again, these films are all on streaming services 00:32:13.539 --> 00:32:15.979 at this point too. But for the most part, or most of them are. 00:32:16.459 --> 00:32:20.119 Conclave's been on Peacock here in the US for weeks now, many weeks, 00:32:20.199 --> 00:32:25.739 a couple months. I turned on to open the Apple TV app and there was an aura right there at the top. 00:32:26.311 --> 00:32:29.411 Oh, for, yeah, for assuming your purchase. Yeah, yeah. 00:32:29.851 --> 00:32:33.791 So they'll push it out. And then again, that's part of the equation now. 00:32:33.871 --> 00:32:37.131 It's not, I mean, yes, they put it back in theaters this weekend for one, 00:32:37.231 --> 00:32:41.391 kind of a one weekend push to take advantage of that. But I bet you dollars to donuts. 00:32:41.631 --> 00:32:46.491 More people were watching it home there, you know, home rental for 10 bucks 00:32:46.491 --> 00:32:48.671 or 20 bucks, whatever it was this week. 00:32:48.811 --> 00:32:52.151 Then they were going to the theaters to see it. So, which is all money in neon's pocket, by the way. 00:32:52.211 --> 00:32:55.031 And it's all positive for the studio. So it's just that, you know, 00:32:55.171 --> 00:32:57.491 again, the business, the viewing habits have changed and it's just not, 00:32:57.511 --> 00:33:00.651 you know, the same as it was once before. But it's a nice pop. 00:33:00.831 --> 00:33:03.011 20 million people saw the wins. And if you hadn't seen the film, 00:33:03.131 --> 00:33:03.931 maybe you're more curious. 00:33:04.291 --> 00:33:08.851 It is a little bit of marketing there to go see these films if you hadn't seen before. 00:33:09.111 --> 00:33:13.271 And another consequence is that I've had defying gravity in my head for about 00:33:13.271 --> 00:33:17.671 a week after watching that performance at the Oscars as well from Wicked. 00:33:17.711 --> 00:33:19.251 Oh, wow. Okay. All right. 00:33:21.651 --> 00:33:24.671 Wicked, I still haven't. And that still eluded me, but we'll see. 00:33:24.751 --> 00:33:26.691 That's on Peacock. Maybe I'll check it out. 00:33:26.811 --> 00:33:30.771 I haven't seen it yet. I have reasons. We'll discuss them off air. 00:33:31.511 --> 00:33:34.951 Okay, fair enough. Sean McNulty, thank you so much for joining me. 00:33:35.031 --> 00:33:36.651 Where can people keep up with you? 00:33:37.311 --> 00:33:39.471 Yeah, my newsletter, The Wake Up, comes out from The Ankler. 00:33:39.551 --> 00:33:41.991 You go to theankler.com to sign up. 00:33:42.171 --> 00:33:46.591 You can find me. I'm a LinkedIn guy. I have tried and true, better or worse. 00:33:46.811 --> 00:33:50.851 So I'm Sean, S-E-A-N, McNulty, M-C-N-U-L-T-Y. 00:33:51.131 --> 00:33:53.931 Just search me there on LinkedIn. in you can find me there as well 00:33:53.931 --> 00:33:57.851 uh the two main places to uh to find me yeah he 00:33:57.851 --> 00:34:00.631 is a linkedin guy but don't let that put you off sean's actually really 00:34:00.631 --> 00:34:03.431 nice and quite fun to talk to yeah i will respond i 00:34:03.431 --> 00:34:06.251 respond to all my messages i'm very active on that that's how 00:34:06.251 --> 00:34:11.211 we first got in touch exactly i'm at charlotte a henry across social media please 00:34:11.211 --> 00:34:16.311 head over to the edition.net where you can get podcasts blog posts newsletters 00:34:16.311 --> 00:34:20.911 everything that covers the crossover between culture media and sport so please 00:34:20.911 --> 00:34:25.911 do join me there sure thanks once again for being back on the show and i'll see you all next week. 00:34:26.640 --> 00:34:35.450 Music.